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		<title>Comment on What, exactly, is civility? You tell us! by gregmunno</title>
		<link>http://cnyspeaks.com/2011/02/17/civic-discourse/#comment-294</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[gregmunno]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 13 Jan 2012 04:11:33 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[What&#039;s the strategic reason behind arguing a point in a public forum? If it is to persuade others who may hold a view contrary to yours, you have to be careful not to push them into a defensive posture, you have to be careful not turn a policy debate into something personal. A thick skin and sense of humor are clearly assets in the public arena. But few people want to be part of such a scrum. CNYSpeaks, meanwhile, is interested in inclusive, constructive conversation. So I still think tone and restraint are part of the equation. I guess it depends on your goals.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What&#8217;s the strategic reason behind arguing a point in a public forum? If it is to persuade others who may hold a view contrary to yours, you have to be careful not to push them into a defensive posture, you have to be careful not turn a policy debate into something personal. A thick skin and sense of humor are clearly assets in the public arena. But few people want to be part of such a scrum. CNYSpeaks, meanwhile, is interested in inclusive, constructive conversation. So I still think tone and restraint are part of the equation. I guess it depends on your goals.</p>
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		<title>Comment on What, exactly, is civility? You tell us! by Phil</title>
		<link>http://cnyspeaks.com/2011/02/17/civic-discourse/#comment-293</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Phil]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jan 2012 21:43:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cnyspeaks.com/?p=546#comment-293</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Denise&#039;s comment is well taken--and it also proves my point.  The emphasis on civility is often code for suppressing speech that may upset the &quot;polite company&quot; that Denise is concerned about.  I do not care if someone is offended when I make reasoned comments  about issues I care about.  My only concerns are the factuality of my argument and allowing others to make dissenting points. 

The issue of &quot;civility&quot; at public meetings became an issue because the Tea Baggers deliberately sought to drown out debate and bloody the noses of the President and the U.S. Representatives supporting health care reform.  Groups like CNYSpeaks missed the boat when they focused on issues of tone and civility, rather than on issues of intent and free speech. (and what shadowy corporate/political operatives funded this deliberate mission of the Tea Baggers.) 

To Denise and all members of polite company: Tea bagging is a sexual act between two consenting homosexual males.  The nascent group of Tea Party protestors used this term to describe themselves--because they were unaware of the double entendre.  I choose to honor the originalists&#039; use of the term Tea Bagger.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Denise&#8217;s comment is well taken&#8211;and it also proves my point.  The emphasis on civility is often code for suppressing speech that may upset the &#8220;polite company&#8221; that Denise is concerned about.  I do not care if someone is offended when I make reasoned comments  about issues I care about.  My only concerns are the factuality of my argument and allowing others to make dissenting points. </p>
<p>The issue of &#8220;civility&#8221; at public meetings became an issue because the Tea Baggers deliberately sought to drown out debate and bloody the noses of the President and the U.S. Representatives supporting health care reform.  Groups like CNYSpeaks missed the boat when they focused on issues of tone and civility, rather than on issues of intent and free speech. (and what shadowy corporate/political operatives funded this deliberate mission of the Tea Baggers.) </p>
<p>To Denise and all members of polite company: Tea bagging is a sexual act between two consenting homosexual males.  The nascent group of Tea Party protestors used this term to describe themselves&#8211;because they were unaware of the double entendre.  I choose to honor the originalists&#8217; use of the term Tea Bagger.</p>
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		<title>Comment on What, exactly, is civility? You tell us! by gregmunno</title>
		<link>http://cnyspeaks.com/2011/02/17/civic-discourse/#comment-292</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[gregmunno]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jan 2012 21:20:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cnyspeaks.com/?p=546#comment-292</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hi Denise and thank you for the comment. I&#039;m curious: If you were me, would you have deleted Phil&#039;s comment?

Here&#039;s my take: 

I agree with you that the term &quot;Tea Baggers,&quot; which is clearly a derogatory reference for those who identify with the Tea Party movement, is not particularly civil. 

However, I think the rest of Phil&#039;s comments were insightful and contributed meaningfully to the conversation -- especially since he left the first comment, thus sparking the dialog, which I appreciate. 

We can&#039;t promote civility to the extent that it suppresses discourse, which, in essence, is Phil&#039;s point. 

Likewise, we can&#039;t promote a free-for-all that completely disregards civility, leading to conversations that have little value in the marketplace of ideas.  

We need on-topic, relevant, open-minded, informed discussion that represent the plurality of perspectives that make up our society.

I think this is best done in a civil way, where commentators refrain from personal attacks and focus on the issues at hand; where a diversity of opinions and people can be heard and taken seriously.    

But I can&#039;t hope for genuine dialog AND impose my ideal of what the dialog should sound like. 

Instead, I choose to tease out the &quot;best&quot; of what I hear and read -- ie, comments that advance the discussion. 

Dialog is a two-way street (at least) and I want to do my part to advance and promote it. It can be a bit of a balancing act, and I am certainly open to the idea that I sometimes get it wrong. 

I&#039;d love to hear more for Denise and others on this. What are your feelings on how to handle comments that have value but are not particularly civil in the context of a facilitated dialog?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Denise and thank you for the comment. I&#8217;m curious: If you were me, would you have deleted Phil&#8217;s comment?</p>
<p>Here&#8217;s my take: </p>
<p>I agree with you that the term &#8220;Tea Baggers,&#8221; which is clearly a derogatory reference for those who identify with the Tea Party movement, is not particularly civil. </p>
<p>However, I think the rest of Phil&#8217;s comments were insightful and contributed meaningfully to the conversation &#8212; especially since he left the first comment, thus sparking the dialog, which I appreciate. </p>
<p>We can&#8217;t promote civility to the extent that it suppresses discourse, which, in essence, is Phil&#8217;s point. </p>
<p>Likewise, we can&#8217;t promote a free-for-all that completely disregards civility, leading to conversations that have little value in the marketplace of ideas.  </p>
<p>We need on-topic, relevant, open-minded, informed discussion that represent the plurality of perspectives that make up our society.</p>
<p>I think this is best done in a civil way, where commentators refrain from personal attacks and focus on the issues at hand; where a diversity of opinions and people can be heard and taken seriously.    </p>
<p>But I can&#8217;t hope for genuine dialog AND impose my ideal of what the dialog should sound like. </p>
<p>Instead, I choose to tease out the &#8220;best&#8221; of what I hear and read &#8212; ie, comments that advance the discussion. </p>
<p>Dialog is a two-way street (at least) and I want to do my part to advance and promote it. It can be a bit of a balancing act, and I am certainly open to the idea that I sometimes get it wrong. </p>
<p>I&#8217;d love to hear more for Denise and others on this. What are your feelings on how to handle comments that have value but are not particularly civil in the context of a facilitated dialog?</p>
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		<title>Comment on What, exactly, is civility? You tell us! by Denise</title>
		<link>http://cnyspeaks.com/2011/02/17/civic-discourse/#comment-291</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Denise]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 12 Jan 2012 16:45:09 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description><![CDATA[The first comment from Phil, that you actually complimented, was not in the spirit of civility. Just what are &quot;Tea Baggers?&quot; I&#039;ll bet that you could not define that term in polite company.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The first comment from Phil, that you actually complimented, was not in the spirit of civility. Just what are &#8220;Tea Baggers?&#8221; I&#8217;ll bet that you could not define that term in polite company.</p>
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		<title>Comment on Making Public Meetings Work for the Public by Promoting Civil Discourse: Participant Recommendations &#171; CNYSpeaks</title>
		<link>http://cnyspeaks.com/2011/01/11/making-public-meetings-work-for-the-public/#comment-271</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Promoting Civil Discourse: Participant Recommendations &#171; CNYSpeaks]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 16 Mar 2011 19:31:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://cnyspeaks.com/?p=525#comment-271</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[[...] February 18, 2011, over 80 community members gathered for a public forum called, &#8220;Making Public Meetings Work for the Public: A Forum on Finding Ways to Make Public Hearings, Forums, and Meetings more Civil, Constructive, [...]]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] February 18, 2011, over 80 community members gathered for a public forum called, &#8220;Making Public Meetings Work for the Public: A Forum on Finding Ways to Make Public Hearings, Forums, and Meetings more Civil, Constructive, [...]</p>
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